Curse

ALF71BE · Nov 25, 2008, 10:14 PM // 22:14

^ Or worse, FomF. Which is quite better being disabled.

legacyofkain85 · Nov 25, 2008, 11:26 PM // 23:26

because its a 5 energy interupt which disables a skill for 20 seconds upon interuption which means u wont be spaming flare no more lol for example.

Fay Vert · Nov 25, 2008, 11:30 PM // 23:30

I think there may also be an element of (possibly irrationally) feeling superior.

When you Dshot an enemy key skill, one is tempted to think "Aha! Gotcha".

Its fun!

upier · Nov 26, 2008, 12:04 AM // 00:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by valence

Taking Savage over Dshot tho, is something I disagree with. In nearly every case the skill you savaged is better off being dshotted.

Is the effect of D-Shot stronger?
Yes, it is.
Does it matter?
The simple fact that an insane number of people complete PvE running things like Sabway/Discordway which mostly include NO interrupts at all, should put the importance of it into perspective.

Yes, in theory D-Shot is vastly superior. Given the monk/ritu example - yeah, I want the guy's rez to be D-shotted instead of Savaged. But then I remember what that looks like in reality and all I see are dead ritualists and dead monks everywhere.
Without D-shotting anything. So if you are going to interrupt things - you might as well do some sweet damage while you are at it.

D-Shot seems to be to advanced for the simplicity that is PvE. And considering you are giving up damage for it - very rarely does the trade-off seem to be worth it. (Outside of the "Gotcha!"-moment! Which I can TOTALLY relate to!

)

Yeah, I get that it's a sweet option if you want multiple interrupts, or if you are concerned about the cost of your skills.
Other then that - it just seems ... decent.

wind fire and ice · Nov 26, 2008, 12:10 AM // 00:10

the point is,that disrupting shot is useful for WoH/ect even if not every mob has it,savage has no use at all really other then a little damage,but rangers arent for damage and in pve there gonna die maybe .5secs faster if they take another 20-30damage..

So,though neither are needed for pve,dshot is better because when a skill that would be better off disabled does come up it can be,where with savage its just a useless spot on your bar other then rupting things that arent important.
Not saying that taking savage over dshot makes you bad,but its not a smart choice..

Daisuko · Nov 26, 2008, 12:23 AM // 00:23

distracting shot is silly tbh. I used BHA + Dshot and rapid fire as my primary skills for about 1/3 of HM, then just used prepared shot and savage shot for the rest. I find daze overkill because 98% of foes are dead 1~2 seconds after daze hits anyway.

Lishy · Nov 26, 2008, 12:30 AM // 00:30

Because a copy of it is in wow

upier · Nov 26, 2008, 01:05 AM // 01:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by wind fire and ice

the point is,that distracting shot is useful for WoH/ect even if not every mob has it,savage has no use at all really other then a little damage,but rangers aren't for damage and in pve there gonna die maybe .5secs faster if they take another 20-30damage..

See, that's exactly my point.
Dying faster is good in my book.

And if people can't get rangers to do damage - then they are doing it wrong. Because that's the heart of the problem. In current PvE EVERYTHING (outside of the obvious damage negation options of course!) is for damage. And because damage is so easy to achieve - the more advanced abilities lost their meaning.

Daisuko · Nov 26, 2008, 02:15 AM // 02:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

See, that's exactly my point.
Dying faster is good in my book.

And if people can't get rangers to do damage - then they are doing it wrong. Because that's the heart of the problem. In current PvE EVERYTHING (outside of the obvious damage negation options of course!) is for damage. And because damage is so easy to achieve - the more advanced abilities lost their meaning.

Well, in my book PvE = Damage > Healing. That's it. You need more healing than the damage dealt to you, and more damage than the enemy is healed. However you achieve this is up to you. Interrupts are useful, albeit less satisfying than high damage, but if you reduce the amount of healing they can receive, it becomes easier to kill. However, I find savage shot to be far superior to D-Shot in PvE, as 5r > 10r, and the bonus damage is nothing to scoff at; Most things you'd want to interrupt are difficult to interrupt in HM anyway... 50% Faster casting times on say, WoH is incredibly hard to interrupt. You can predict WHEN they will cast, but that's not a sure thing either.

Amy Awien · Nov 26, 2008, 07:35 AM // 07:35

Actually a .4 sec skill is near impossible to interrupt with a .5 sec activation time skill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

The simple fact that an insane number of people complete PvE running things like Sabway/Discordway which mostly include NO interrupts at all, should put the importance of it into perspective.

Yes, you can beat through healing and rezzes, you can savage shot a Word of Healing. It is unfortunate though that it has a shorter recharge then Savage Shot and it will heal away the damage your triple Discord spike did, and that will slow down the process.

Or is there a skill you can replace D-Shot with that out damages WoH?

Quote:

Yes, in theory D-Shot is vastly superior.

Only in theory will you be able to kill stuff before they get of their major damage and healing skills or rezz stuff.

AshenX · Nov 26, 2008, 08:00 AM // 08:00

The recharge time difference between d-shot and savage shot isnt really an issue in PVE as most monsters do not have skills worth the interrupting. Those few that do will likely have only one skill that is really worth your effort to interrupt (aegis, WOH, etc.) THis means that out of an entire mob you will likely have only one or two skills that really call for an interrupt in order to significantly affect the course of the fight. D-shot's recharge rate is more than sufficient for such circumstances and its low energy cost/disable function combine to make it a nice choice.

That said, Savage shot works just fine. With expertise the energy cost isnt a problem and the low recharge can be nice in situations where you might actually need a greater frequency of interruption.

upier · Nov 26, 2008, 08:42 AM // 08:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amy Awien

Yes, you can beat through healing and rezzes, you can savage shot a Word of Healing. It is unfortunate though that it has a shorter recharge then Savage Shot and it will heal away the damage your triple Discord spike did, and that will slow down the process.

Or is there a skill you can replace D-Shot with that out damages WoH?

When you have 6 guys pounding one foe - and you Savage Shot his WoH - how fast will he die?
Given the reality of PvE that is.
If the battle would go on for ages, D-Shot would be vastly superior.
But it doesn't.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amy Awien

Only in theory will you be able to kill stuff before they get of their major damage and healing skills or rezz stuff.

In the age of PvE skills and it's constant KDs?
Besides - the offensive stuff that does get through - PS/SY! will take care of.
Whereas the foes that negate damage are mostly the first ones to be disposed of.

Yes, there definitely are certain places where D-Shot will be preferred. I just feel, and that's why I started this, it's important to keep in mind that those places aren't very common and that some alternatives not only perform as good - but a lot of times even better in the more common places. Quite simply because you are giving up the simplicity of killing for the advanced option of disabling something.
Just something to think of when you start building your bar and the first thing you put on is D-Shot.

Cebe · Nov 26, 2008, 08:45 AM // 08:45

Upier, seems to me you're making a good case for not taking a Ranger into PvE at all!

If it wasn't for BHA...

cataphract · Nov 26, 2008, 12:26 PM // 12:26

The only time my ranger leaves home without d-shot is when she's running people to desert missions and outposts.

It is the single most defining skill of the Ranger profession. Like Frenzy is for Warrior.

upier · Nov 26, 2008, 12:44 PM // 12:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by cataphract

It is the single most defining skill of the Ranger profession. Like Frenzy is for Warrior.

And then in PvE - everyone Flails. (And no need for a "No, that's "Everyone FAILS!""-joke. I get it.

)

cataphract · Nov 26, 2008, 12:49 PM // 12:49

I don't... Q__Q

The Meth · Nov 26, 2008, 02:14 PM // 14:14

Yeah, I can agree distracting shot is mostly meaningless in PvE. In NM everything dies if you so much as glance at it, while in HM cast times are decreased so you aren't going to have much chance to interrupt outside of things like MS. It works for a select few enemies with longer and/or predictable spells, but daze is really so much better for any serious work in HM.

Doesn't stop me from taking it though. Costing almost no energy IS a benefit when my ranger is spitting out 5-10e PvE skills all the time. Besides, if I'm not interrupting I don't feel like a ranger.

Quaker · Nov 26, 2008, 07:44 PM // 19:44

If you are running a interrupt Ranger build, there can be a lot of debate about what interrupts you carry, although BHA is pretty universal.

However, if you are running some other build (Barrage, Beast Master, etc.), where interrupting is not the primary focus, Distracting Shot is the best all-round choice. In that case, generally speaking, I am concentrating on the other aspects of my build, not on interrupting.

The main feature that makes D-shot special, imo, is the shutdown. True other interrupts may be faster, etc., but having to only interrupt a particular skill once will reduce your (and your team's) overall energy useage.

grim lavamancer joe · Nov 27, 2008, 11:28 PM // 23:28

quarterbreaking is good. the ability for a person to do this and also anticipate when to do this is what seperates the average from the extrordinary. i also noticed that this discussion is only talking about the offensive purpose of distracting shot.

what about the DEFENSIVE purpose of distracting shot? in factions, nightfall, and gwen; bosses deal double damage. and even more so in HM. lets say your vanquishing the resplendant makuun and you run into Kormab, Burning Heart. Kormab has the ability to deal well over 200 damage to any target with a 5r spell. sure you may be able to daze him for about 50% of time, but during that other 50% hes butchering your monks (because honestly, the majority PvE monks are lazy and cant prot worth a penny). you know that kormab is going to cast mindburn on recharge, but even quarterbreaking your not going to get it all.
so is it better to disable it for 20 seconds and give your monks a little breathing room, or deal +20 damage. your call

cataphract · Nov 28, 2008, 07:14 AM // 07:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

When you have 6 guys pounding one foe - and you Savage Shot his WoH - how fast will he die?
Given the reality of PvE that is.
If the battle would go on for ages, D-Shot would be vastly superior.
But it doesn't.

PUGs say hi.